Let's say you were born only 5'9", average face and with a 5 inch penis. Could any self-improvement like lifting weights or a decent career put you into the top 20% of men who actually get all the girls and girlfriends?
Is it even possible to get into the top 20% of men with average genetics?
rule 1 of Ari Onassis
Rule 9.
do you spend that extra 3 hours just fucking posting this in every thread
>"bro just sleep less, you'll have more time shitposting on IST"
>"yeah don't worry about your brain doing that thing that it couldn't remove through evolution"
>dies at 69 from neurological failure
I wonder if all aristotle fags are spending this saved time on something useful instead of browsing IST
whats that jogger talk about preying on rich people for big loans? Wonder why "rich" people are lonely when they have to deal with some attic jogger befriending them for zero interest loans. ngmi
Which book dis?
shit pic. dude on the left obviously lifts, you see he has good arms, traps and shoulders. dude on the left is DYEL.
half the retards don't understand that shoulder width is mostly due to deltoid thickness, not bone. then they screech "muh shoulder genetics" and "muh cards". losers will stay losers I guess
Maybe not. Maybe you can’t only get to the top 25%. Or maybe you can only get into the top 50%. So what? It’s still worth it to improve yourself. Stop making pussy-ass demoralization threads.
>losers will stay losers
I think that’s generally true. But what I don’t get is why they feel the need to try to publicly make excuses for themselves. Are they so pathetic that they need to try to drag others down with them?
Well, if you ever want to get a girlfriend in your life instead of dying alone and unloved you need to get into the top 20% of men.
Better get lifting, then.
As of 2021, 47% of people in the US never married. So if that's your main goal you only need to be in the top 50%.
In the animal kingdom 80% of males never get to mate, so we're doing pretty well considering.
Unironically have incels ever talked to someone outside the internet?
Go out on the street and ask every 40 something year old man if they have kids, i guarantee at least 55% will say they have
losers love excuses. look at fatties, they keep screeching "muh genetics" and "it's literally impossible to lose weight". then they also say "this girl eats as much as she wants and she's thin, so it's genetics' fault why I'm 100lb overweight".
same with DYELs, they'd rather conclude "it's literally impossible" than actually seek solution
t. blind
Yeah you'd have to be blind not to see the posture difference between the two. The Chad is has his lats relaxed and spread and is not afraid of taking up space. Lanklet looks like he's wants to be as small as possible and even in his living room he's scrunching his shoulders together.
>half the retards don't understand that shoulder width is mostly due to deltoid thickness, not bone
you're a complete fucking retard. never post on the internet ever again nor share your opinion ever again in real life as well you complete braindead fuck.
>no argument
you're wrong then, also seethe harder
Yes but unlikely. Try and see.
>losers will stay losers
Pretty much the whole point of blackpilling studies, yeah. Tough one to swallow but there are exceptions. You can't know if it's truly over until everything failed.
>OP looks at instagram and tiktok and thinks life is 100% like that
Normies do think life is 100% like that and if you want to make it, you need their approval in your professional life, in your love life, in your circle of friends. Normies and their retarded perceptions dictate the false reality that society enforces on you.
Yeah in Africa and Asia, but I expect most people here to know about civilization. The west is getting closer and closer to a 6inch average. The stats are already portraying a lower average than reality because of mass immigration of shitskins of the third world.
>Crying over it doesn't do shit. Improve
Based. All was said.
>half the retards don't understand that shoulder width is mostly due to deltoid thickness, not bone. then they screech "muh shoulder genetics" and "muh cards"
Everything is unironically proportions. It's not about the width of your shoulders, or your deltoids, it's about the ratio of your shoulders to your hips, which IS purely 100% genetics. Some guys have narrow hips and broader shoulders, and they will always, unfailingly, look stronger than a guy with a poor ratio even if he's stronger.
If you were born with a broad frame or large hips, there's very little you can do about it. You're always going to get mogged
the width of your hips isn't purely genetic, most of the variance in males comes from whether they grew up fat or not.
most guys with wide hips grew up obese.
Hormones play a role, but we can chalk most of that up to genetics, too, unless there's some environmental factor being a major contributor (unlikely). Obesity does affect hormones but it would be a huge error to say that genetics isn't the underlying factor in bone structure
You're also looking at androgen receptor density and men with less of it have a tendency to be less lean and more feminized just by virtue of their genetics and not any hormonal imbalance
they play a huge role in specifically this
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7224231/
>was able to describe 54.8% variability of pelvic breadth among males.
I'm saying adolescents aren't randomly obese
Hormones and hormone receptors were already at play which caused that outcome
obesity works similarly to second hand smoke, being around smokers makes you more likely to smoke, it's contagious to an extend, the more fat people there are the more likely they are to create new fat people in lineages that aren't fat yet, which will then pass on their behavior to their children.
You still need to consume more calories than you burn.
Holy shit that is me.
So my obesity caused the hips?
>grew up fluffy, completely untrained upper body
>had thicc booty and narrow ribcage and shoulders
>only considered femboybottom route in 30s
bros in heaven are having a laff, and so am I
maybe. but my point is, doing nothing about it won't make things better. you could be born with narrow shoulders, but if you work out you could get them to at least normal width. saying "it's impossible to change, it's just the cards" is stupid.
and if it's really THAT bad for someone, roids could actually be a solution.
Absolutely delusional.
>average face
Never gonna make the top 20% with average anything. The clues in the name "average".
Not true. Having no flaws with average everything already makes you top 20%.
You have to actually be aggressive and high T to get women. You have to exude a masculine sexual energy, something you're just not doing. I know a bunch of manlet guys in my own personal life that all kill it with women, they just are aggressive and relentlessly sexual. If you aren't like that then it won't work, doesn't matter how tall you are. You're just coping rather than learning the game
5'9 is not THAT bad. It's above most national medians. But yeah if you've got a tiny penis you won't have much staying power.
t. 5'11, 8 inch dick, good face, fit
5 inches is not tiny
5'9 is statistically equivalent to 5" penor. If you disagree you probably measured your own penor wrongly
Think of it this way:
Top 20% are serious athletes
Next 20% are people who take their health seriously, who play a sport seriously or go to the gym more than 3 times a week.
The 20% below that are weekend warriors; people who are fine just going to the gym maybe once or twice a week, or going to a weekly Yoga class.
The second to bottom 20% are people who might not go to the gym, but they eat fruit and vegetables, or they might eat fast food daily, but they also play basketball five nights a week.
Then the bottom 20% are people who are just beyond unhealthy. Morbidly obese, drug addicts, pale neets who never leave their rooms, et cetera.
Maybe you'll never be in the top twenty percent, but you can easily be in the next twenty percent, just don't fall to the bottom 40.
Your numbers are all wrong
5% serious athletes
15% serious about health
20% weekend warriors
20% out of shape but still relatively healthy
40% obese/neet/drug addict
I like to think of it as a bell curve. Everyone starts a set deviation above or below the average.
Going to the gym consistently moves you up 2 standard deviations
Being relatively active moves you up 1
Being relatively sedentary moves you down 1
Actively stuffing your face and never leaving the house moves you down 2.
So even if you we born in the bottom 90%, you can still look at or better than average with dedication
OP looks at instagram and tiktok and thinks life is 100% like that
and that your life NEEDS to be like that
there are poorfag manlets with a wife and kids
still not happy because they think they need a villa or a luxury car or somme bullshit
or they are happy because don't want what they don't need.
honestly kys bro, if you weren't born into a wealthy family with generations of good breeding
and genetics.
>in retrospect i would rather not be tall and have a small cock
I'm unhappy and resentful because I don't get to spend my time rustling cattle, fucking slave girls and eating fresh produce
If you lived in this time there is a 90% chance that you would be a manlet skinnyfat grain farmer and would either die of plague, wound infection, starvation or when a rival tribe invaded your land to rape your wife and daughter
lol your weak ass would be a slave in some gay's dungeon
What else are your fucking options? My best friend is jacked despite not working out in 2 years and has a fat cock getting all the pussy. So? Crying over it doesn't do shit. Improve
5.1 inch penis is literally the average in a lot of countries, what is your fucking problem
He probably doesn't live in a tiny dick country
Most ppl on the planet have 5 inch
Most people in the planet live are Chinese and Indian, groups that are literally notorious for their tiny dicks.
yes
yes
women do care about physique, a lot, but a large part is because it's a reflection of your behaviour and self-image
without having top 20% fitness genetics
you need an above average work ethic
then IQ helps
>women do care about physique, a lot,
Correct
>but a large part is because it's a reflection of your behaviour and self-image
LMFAOOO no.
Don't buy the "wahmanz will see muh efforts" bullshit, OP. Women only care about RESULTS.
I'd argue the majority of women unironically think fit ripped guys get like that by just playing some sports and having good genes. That's why I NEVER hint that I'm a regular gym goer, and get mires and even light touches (don't get their pussy because I'm married) from them, they never bother asking me if I'm a genelet who spends 4-5 days a week in the gym and eat healthy most days of the week, they just lust for deez fine pecs and shoulders
Another one who plays the game well met
>Don't buy the "wahmanz will see muh efforts" bullshit, OP. Women only care about RESULTS.
Telling a woman how hard you've busted your ass to get your foot in the door with her is the fastest way have her vagina slam shut.
no. i am in the top 20% and i have friends that are not. getting women is easy for me, i dont need to work for it. i fucked an 8/10 italian girl on sunday and we are gonna fuck again soon and tonight i have a redhead girl coming over and im gonna do bad stuff to her. i have always been good at sports, maintain a natural level of fitness, i have a law degree and i am never short of money. i am waiting for some retards to start coping and seething but i promise you this is the truth. being top 20 percent is as much attitude as it is genetics bros.
You wouldn't be here if you were in the 20% larper
i knew it would only be a matter of time till the coping began. i've been browsing this website since 2006, there is no escape.
I am absolutely in the top 20% bud
friendly reminder that medial delts and neck blow every other muscle out of the water, aesthetically
you should train your entire body but if you dont blast those 2 as frequently as possible then you are fuckin retarded
How can I train them I’m DYEL
I do it passively while having sex with women but idk if that’s gonna work for you bro you might have to ask someone else
Yes.
T. 5'9" 5,75 inch penis average mutt face
It's more like the top 10% on the apps, which makes sense, since only about 1/3 of women are bangable and there's a 3:1 male:female ratio on the apps.
The thing about about a top 20% guy is that it's a combination of ANDs
You aren't fat like 70% of men AND you make at least $10k more than her AND you have above average fashion sense AND you have a way to convey that value to women (Good instagram, above average conversationalist) AND you live somewhere where the attractive women are
Sure, since something like 40% of men in the west are obese. Simply not being a fatass already puts you in the top half.
You just took two extreme ends of the distribution. Most people fall somewhere in the middle, phaggot.
Just as people have been getting fatter on average, male facial aesthetics have been getting worse on average.
Yet women still want the top 20% COPE COPE COPE
Yeah, that's kinda what happens when women make good money and the society doesn't hold men in general in esteem. Most men just become glorified dildos.
Is there any way for someone who was born average to not have to see /LULZ/ lookism threads? At least the [porn image, vaguely fitness-related question] threads are good for a test boost.
Camera took pic from above.
Guy hides his hips.
Has a bit of muscle.
Is lean.
Small head and face.
If you saw him IRL he probably doesn't look as chad
Are you retarded?
Guy on the left clearly lifts, look at how developed his delts are.
Guy on the right is skinny af
I have a wide ass frame but I hate women.
Mirin. Firearms looking swole
If your starting:
1. Height
2. Bone density
3. Frame
are average or above average you will be fine. If they are BELLOW average in all 3 categories forget it.
So basically if you are a manlet, with frail bones and narrow frame you won't be able to compete with the top 20% even if you lift your whole life. Sorry.
also forgot to add
1. Average height is 5'9 barefoot, anything bellow that is manlet.
2. Average wrist is 7 inch + anything bellow that is frail
3. Average frame is self explanatory. Look yourself in the mirror. If you have large shoulders you are fine. Unless your large shoulders are matched with large hips and thin waist like an hourglass figure. It's not too bad I guess but the key is having large shoulders.
Why do you want to be in the top 20% of men?
Not only is that impossible to quantify, but surely it's miserable to live your life comparing yourself to others.
What are you, a teenage girl?
Do teenage boys not compare themselves to others? The important thing is whether it motivates you to improve or to put others down.
Trying to be in the top 20% of something subjective isn't motivation to improve.
It's working towards something meaningless and unattainable.
But there is no such thing as top 20% of men, people love all sorts of others, there is no "top" man
If you think any girl who isn't fat wouldn't date somebody under some made up percentage, you are delusional
>If you think any girl who isn't fat wouldn't date somebody under some made up percentage, you are delusional
A woman who isn't fat has effectively infinite choice horizons, and needs easy heuristics to make dating manageable for her when every man wants to bone her.
"He can't be fat unless he's 6-feet tall" is an easy way to make her overwhelming choices manageable.
That seems a bit much, you're assuming men do not have any standards even in the high %.
80% of male attention goes to the hottest 20% of women, even if they accurately rate them on a bell curve.
In the US the 80th% is basically just "not medically overweight"
You're describing the dumbest possible person who dates on instinct rather than because they really like somebody.
It unjustly removes a lot of agency from women to assume that they think this way.
People like to find reasons to justify why they are lonely.
It is not easy to be lonely, but I hate how these thoughts perpetuate and give youths an unrealistic depiction of the world and how people think.
And once you enter these modes of thinking, it is very difficult to escape.
>It unjustly removes a lot of agency from women to assume that they think this way.
You're incredibly naive. Go ask an attractive female friend if you can see what her Tinder or Hinge looks like.
>agency
I don't see how "sexual selection is predicated on female choice" denies agency to women. If anything, men lack agency in dating - because they present themselves for judgment. Men do not do the choosing.
My attractive female friends don't use tinder lol
I think you need to meet some actual women instead of basing your perception of reality off of instagram sluts
Agreed
>My attractive female friends don't use tinder lol
They probably have moved to Hinge or Bumble, since your milieu is probably white people with degrees. Tinder is increasingly for students, declasse women, and prostitutes.
But the reality is that most couples have met from online dating (which means the swipe apps, not OKC) since 2016 or so.
>Go ask an attractive female friend if you can see what her Tinder or Hinge looks like.
tinder is mostly the bottom 80% of women, even if you're good looking you're not going to find any quality on there.
most marriages end up in a divorce, what 'most couples' do isn't very relevant, they don't have any statistic going for them.
dating websites and social media is mostly unattractive people pissing on each other.
>tinder is mostly the bottom 80% of women, even if you're good looking you're not going to find any quality on there.
You're just average. Tinder is 75% men. Men - even Chads- swipe way more than women. Women swipe left 90% of the time.
Napkin math would put a Male 6 in the bottom 30% or so of elo based on gender ratios and swiping habits. Obviously, Tinder has priority queues and some other shenanigans; but I think the rough approximation works.
I can understand that someone might be unsatisfied with what nature gave them. There is nothing unusual in that. But to wallow in self pity and to make an image like the one above trying to demotivate everyone else is just absolutely pathetic and is what makes someone actually a loser. The people who do best in life generally just don't give a fuck and keep going. The endlessly obsessive and bitter fall to the bottom regardless of how well they started
Women have options thanks to dating apps and social media. They will choose the man they find most attractive or will choose making money online through onlyfans etc rather than dating some 5/10 average joe beta bux
The risk of dating an OF thot is exaggerated. There are ~300k women worldwide doing it, many with boyfriends.
>most marriages end up in a divorce, what 'most couples' do isn't very relevant, they don't have any statistic going for them.
This is fair. However, contra trads, dual-income highly-educated couples are the least likely to divorce.
even if you manage to secure a nice woman and have children, your children will either die or never pass on their genes due to the poor shape of the planet, I don't know what kind of sadist you are that you want to plunge another being in the modern world, if you want your genes to live on that badly go donate sperm or something.
this is me
I look like the poster child for the Hitler-Jugend, Bund deutscher Arbeiterjugend, I get hundreds of matches on any dating website, it only makes me loathe women more.
you will find absolutely nothing of value on any of them, I recommend you stop worrying about what girls on the internet think and meet someone in real life.
What’s the cycle anon thinking of hopping on gear soon
long clavicles for reps, I'm completely natural.
whatever benefits you think you'll get from being wider or bigger aren't going to help you find women that don't suck, it mostly just helps with women that you don't want to date long term, that is what dating websites are, it's women who couldn't land men any other way because they're insufferable in person, and don't look as good as their pictures make them out to be, and even if they do they won't hold on to it for long, most women in the top 20% end up in the bottom 80% eventually.
the kind of woman you'd want to marry isn't the kind that worries about made up numbers on the internet and desperately needs someone to be exactly above x and y metrics to validate herself.
I know this feel, my shoulders hit the side of door frames so I'm used to trying to be as narrow as possible.
I know you won't believe me, but I met my wife playing vidya 5 years ago.
I hadn't had a real job before, was out of the army with not very much money.
I had never had a friend, was severely depressed, was skinny fat.
She was in med school, came from a very rich family, went to a private school and was beautiful, yet I talked about something that interested me.
There was a spark, and despite all my flaws, I made her happy. And thankfully she helped me come out of a very dark place.
To saying girls will do x, girls will do y is stupid.
Just like you and me are complex people, so are women.
You can not know who they will fall for, and with whom you'll have that spark.
>To saying girls will do x, girls will do y is stupid.
"Generalization is le impossible" is incredibly midwit take, when large numbers of people in practice behave in similar ways which can be modeled and predicted.
Generalizations are possible, but all you need is one.
You're not dealing with people on a group bases, you're dealing with them as individuals
>you're dealing with them as individuals
If vast swathes have similar tastes in entertainment, fashion, music, and so on - they probably have the same tastes in men. NAXALT really isn't relevant, especially given revealed preferences.
You just seem upset when it is pointed out that the odds for finding satisfactory LTR material are actually pretty long, and busting your ass will on average return worse results than 20 - even 10 - years ago. Maybe there is some weird trick to find a scene or place that's a pussy paradise, but that's what PUAs have been doing for the last 10-15 years and they've, dare we say, sold a lot of bridges.
You argue like a deconstructionist trying to abolish his enemy's beliefs. You're wrong on the first two accounts
Because ~80% of American women are overweight or obese.
Because it's the bare minimum needed to get a decent looking woman in 2022
Literally all you can do is play the cards you were dealt. There's literally no alternative except giving up. So what is the point of the image? Some people are genetically blessed and some people are at a natural disadvantage. That's how the world is. Left could be completely overshadowed by someone like the guy on the right in a social situation where the guy on the right is accomplished and respected and left is just some dropout bum.
I swear to fucking god you blackpill gays are just as bad as the lardasses who say that their genetics are responsible for them being a disgusting fatass. The only other option you have is to give up and wallow in self-pity because you aren't automatically a 9 foot tall demi-god. Grow the fuck up and do something with your life instead of trying to justify your complete lack of effort and self-defeating loser mentality to other like-minded losers.
I should thank you OP, because I'm closing this stupid site after posting this. God this board is such a fucking poison. I miss the days when people on here actually pushed each other to do better instead of complaining that they aren't literally perfect from the jump. Fuck you.
Bye gay thanks for getting weeded out
>Getting weeded out
Kek. Oh no, he's been weeded out of the poor-me, never improve club.
I'm 5'5, it was over before it even began
I don't even talk to women anymore outside of professional settings
Whenever I do manage to go on a date you can tell they are visibly disappointed by my height and the fact that I'm close to their height or in some cases shorter than them
Women do not respect a man of my height. Your options are severely limited. 5'6, 5'7 are manageable, but 5'5 and below is the danger zone. Women won't take you seriously, except maybe ones from the Philippines or some really short country
I'm Tinder 6' and have a 7 inch schlong. I still have a tough time and feel sad most of the time
>humans have been having sex for millions of years, no problems arose
>2000 years in the future incels and s-0-yentists actually discover only 6"4' multi-millionares are allowed to reproduce and everyone else is a perma virgin
I fucking swear you can't make this shit up
Are you being genuinely stupid or are you just pretending to be an NPC from Reddit?
>wanting to partake in this sick society instead of enjoying the ride
>wanting to be something you’re not in hopes of approval from those people
>not realizing life isn’t a rat race and you should carve your own niche into this place
I’ve spent many lifetimes here, this one can be dedicated to being jacked and being a weird motherfucker and if people wanna join along they can, I am cringe but I am free
I'm 5'8, average face. Penis is 8 inches and thick, but I don't go around with my cock out so it doesn't really help. That said, I have a nice career, a nice body and plenty of women. I drive a nice car and wear expensive suits so they think I'm rich although I'm not and I've just started building my career. Women are dumber than you think
You certainly won't be in the top 20% doing nothing. The majority of humans fall into the sector of mediocrity. If you don't have the mindset to beat the 80% you will be the 80%. If you make 100k you are already top 20% (much higher if you are still young) If you learn some creative hobby like welding rock bouncers chassis or some shit you're top 20%. If you 1/2/3/4 or have a few degrees on your BJJ belt or you excel at some other sports you are top 20%. What matters isn't the reward of being exceptional but rather the process of becoming it and enjoying that process because it will be life long. The women, the fame, the accolades are largely temporary, your legacy could be forever.
$100k now is the rough equivalent of $33k in 1982. "Six-figure salary" was coined in the early 80s when $100k is equivalent to $300k now.
What a retarded take, outside of living in San Francisco or Seattle 100k is a ton of money especially for one person. As always incels are fucking retards.
And $30k was a good salary in 1982. What's your point?
My point is that the lifestyle people (specifically women) associate with six-figure salaries is the lifestyle of someone who makes $200-300k, not someone making $100k.
Realistically 100k is a lifestyle where money is no longer a problem especially if one person makes it. And if your lifestyle needs more than that then you're a materialistic whore and should be shot like the filthy commies.
Dawg, we've had ~10% inflation this year, and next year is unlikely to get better. $100k is the new $75k.
And with 10% inflation I'm going to have a 10% raise. Lmao the state of incels. A million excuses, always an excuse. Sucks to suck and you'll always be my slave, remember this. There is and always ill be a slave class and you've willingly chosen to stay a slave because you find the mud comfortable.
I accept your concession. Good luck on the raise; hope you don't get garden gnomeed with a 2%.
Concession? You moved the goalposts multiple times. Next time don't talk about things you don't understand poorfag friendless incel.
>Is it even possible to get into the top 20% of men with average genetics?
Yes, just remember that most people don't live up to anywhere near their genetic potential in anything. For an example there are a lot of fatties you could tell would be attractive if they weren't fat. So just putting in a small amount of effort as an average person puts you above average, actually try and you're way above average.
I think some people are just lower caste, they don't have the strength, willpower, intelligence, ability or Fortuna's blessing to advance beyond their limitations, so they are destined to only reap that which belongs to the lower caste. Only a small percentage of individuals can make it despite having all those characteristics you mentioned, That being said, top 20% is nothing, top 0.1% is where it is at.
Kek cloud literally cross dresses in this game. You must be a chud or a homo if you resonate with a character that gay
If you're a white guy, in NA, EU, ANZ, go to college and work out regularly what percentage of men do you think you're in. Probably 1%.
What's the point of working out when girls just love the hip to shoulder ratio
Just don't eat and go for walk
If shit delta do shoulders and ripped that's it
My guy I am a literal 170cm /5'7 Turkish ugly dude who lifts and does muay thai and I had my fair share of European or Asian pussy. Its a numbers game, the amount of messages I sent could be in tens of thousands in multiple apps. Never give up.
then have a nice day you disgraceful fuck, people like you always blame their problems on anything but themselves. God should smite you down but youre lucky he gives you life
no.
the belief you can do it is what makes IST scams so successful
75% of men are overweight.
Yes.
Yes. The men who get laid the most irl are actually the rich businessmen
These are average guys physically, maybe a bit taller than average
It's a retarded meme. We are not the same, someone who spent his teens playing video games will NEVER EVER be able to catch up to someone who spent those formative years playing with friends and dating girls.
STOP
SHAVING
YOUR
HAIR
ffs
Yes. You do the best you can with your cards, then move to a country where the competition is worse.
I'd pick right over left but I wouldn't style myself that way at all (for the record I look almost exactly like left but the subhuman/tattooed/white trash female attention gets very old)
Yes. Get fit and make money.
Yes. Most men have average genetics and don't lift. Just lifting for 5-8 years will make you top 20%. Having a good diet for all that time will make you top 10%